When a band can reasonably claim to have released not one but several of the best New Zealand albums of the 21st century so far, as The Phoenix Foundation can, they’ve earned the right to revisit their old records as they please.
At the end of 2023, they hit the road to celebrate their seminal 2003 debut album, Horse Power, the record that launched the Wellington band on their journey to becoming Aotearoa indie rock icons.
Earlier this year, they celebrated another classic album, Pegasus, by pressing it to vinyl for the very first time to mark its 20th anniversary. They made the right call: it hit the top spot on the Top 20 Aotearoa Albums Chart in May, a feat the original version didn’t even achieve in 2005.
Six months later, they’re gearing up to play their second album in full at The Others Way 2025, which takes place tomorrow across Karangahape Road, Auckland.
Rolling Stone AU/NZ caught up with musician and composer Samuel Flynn Scott, one of the founding members of The Phoenix Foundation, to chat about the festival, his memories of Pegasus, the Wellington music scene, the band’s future plans, and more.
The Others Way 2025 takes place on Saturday, November 29th across Karangahape Road, Auckland. Ticket information can be found here. Stream The Phoenix Foundation’s Pegasus here.
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Rolling Stone AU/NZ: Are you excited to play The Others Way this year?
Samuel Flynn Scott: Yeah, for sure. I think it’s a pretty exciting lineup this year. But, you know, the main problem is I just know I won’t be able to see all the bands I want to see because I’ll be getting ready for my own show. But, yeah, very excited to play.
If you could see one artist on the lineup, who would it be?
Sharon Van Etten. I love Sharon Van Etten, I’d love to see Connan [Mockasin]. I’d love to see HDU [High Dependency Unit], [they] were an influence on me early on, just kind of getting into the idea of guitar as texture. I saw an HDU gig… there were probably 50 people there when [I] was about 20 and it was just totally mind-blowing.
I’d like to see every single band if I’m honest, it’d be great… I reckon I’ll probably see like two things, ’cause I’ll be tuning guitars and setting up pedals.
Have you been rehearsing a lot?
We’ve all been rehearsing by ourselves. We’re together. We’re set up in the Vogelmorn Bowling Club and rehearse in there. There’s a lot of work going into it for sure, it’s [Pegasus] a record we’re still really proud of. So it’s great to go back and kind of dissect that and see what we did.
What’s your abiding memory from that album cycle?
Well, I think one of the things we really unlocked on that record was just our ability to make stuff that was a bit more soundtrack-y… things like “Hitchcock” and “Sea World” and “Twilight”, these sort of instrumentals. We realised we could go a bit further and a bit deeper…
It opened up a lot of creative avenues and also got us into making actual soundtrack music as well. I’m proud of the songs I wrote and sung on that album, but when I look back at it, the thing that really stands out for me are probably the instrumentals.
Has your relationship changed with the album over 20 years? Like, did you have a favourite song when it first came out that’s now changed to something else?
I think because we were so young when we made it, and it’s been a long time, you go through a phase of thinking that it was all trash and just being embarrassed by your lyrics and just not being able to connect with it. And I think you then come full circle and realise that actually it’s pretty good work and you’re a bit more forgiving on your younger self.
You’ve got to be [forgiving].
Yeah, for sure. I don’t know quite how to put it, but I think that it’s not so much that I’ve had a favourite song that’s changed, but just that my view of the whole album has kind of evolved.
Was that the album you were most proud of as a musician?
[It’s] hard to say because that one was a big jump forward for us. So yeah, I am really proud of how we stepped up with that record. But you know, I’m just as proud of Buffalo or I’m just as proud of Give Up Your Dreams or, you know, even what we’re working on at the moment…
[It] must have been so special to get it on vinyl for the first time.
Yeah, it’s so nice having it on vinyl. It sounds really good on vinyl because the music really kind of breathes a bit… It’s a beautiful cover by Louise Clifton and it’s just nice to have that beautiful kind of symbolic object of the music as opposed to just, you know, a little icon and a Spotify window.
That’s something we talk about at Rolling Stone — whenever we speak to artists they always prefer having a print interview than just online because they can pick up the magazine as a keepsake for their family…
Yeah, 100%. I still love the print magazines… I grew up on Rolling Stone and Mojo and Q magazine and The Face and all of these magazines shaped my personality and my worldview. So yeah, I love them.
Talking about the change in perceptions, this album charting better this time than it did the first time, did that surprise you?
Yeah, it kind of did, but it’s also like… I guess we’ve been doing the work for a long time in New Zealand and we knew people loved that record because it was real, it did sell really well over quite a long period of time. It’s probably our second best seller after Buffalo, but maybe our best seller in New Zealand. So, we know people love that record and we knew that people would want it on vinyl.
Do you think that’s a sign maybe you’re getting a younger audience? You’re getting new listeners?
Yeah, I don’t know if that’s all dudes in their 50s with fancy high-fi systems… I’d love it if we were still getting new listeners. That’d be great. It’s really hard for me to tell.
So are you planning to do this for every album or is it more on a case by case basis?
[It] was more on a case by case basis but certainly the first three never came out on vinyl so kind of righting that wrong is one of the intentions because it was so expensive and unusual to press anything on vinyl in the early 2000s… [it] was only dance music that was coming out on vinyl at that time, from what I can remember.
You went on the road for Horse Power, are you planning to do the same [for Pegasus]?
We’re not planning to do the same. We’re working on new material and we’re pretty excited about that. So there’s gonna be some new stuff coming out very soon and maybe not so soon there’ll be another album… we’re still just really interested in exploring the boundaries of music and seeing what exciting shit we can do.
So are we going to see the new music next year or…?
There will be some new music…
It’s always a tough question when you put someone on the spot like that. So you’re playing a show at New Year’s Eve, is that right?
Right. We’re doing a New Year’s show with Fur Patrol, which is pretty exciting, and You Should Be Dancing, which is our old sound guy, Bernie, he’s got this disco thing that is super popular and it’s really fun. So it’s going to be a good New Year’s party at Meow Nui, which is very much my new favourite venue in the country. It’s such a cool spot.
I’ve heard really nice things about it [Meow Nui].
Yeah, it’s really great.
So are you guys all still based around Wellington?
Yep. Well, no Chris [O’Connor] the drummer’s in Auckland.
Because I did want to ask you about Wellington. We did a a scene report on Wellington a few months ago, and it was talking about how there’s a lot of positives, there’s a lot of great musicians, but overall it’s kind of struggling a wee bit. Would that be your take on the scene?
[I] think it has been struggling for probably a few years… compared to when I was coming out, I think it’s much harder for young bands to find rehearsal spaces and DIY venues and all that sort of thing. But I think there’s some exciting changes coming along. I think people are really trying to make the live scene more exciting. And certainly Meow Nui is really good for the bigger and more established acts. But also just the regular Meow is such a cool support of venue as well.
I think there’s always going to be, you know, ebbs and flows. But I think at the moment, lots of businesses have shut down, rents have kind of dropped, and that actually creates a little opportunity for young artists to find cool spaces where they can make new stuff.
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That’s what I did want to ask you — is there a New Zealand band right now that you’re excited about?
I mean, I have been trying to pay more attention but I feel like a lot of the stuff that I’ve been getting into lately is… already quite established.
No, I put you on the spot… that was a tough one.
And part of that is I haven’t been playing a lot of music festivals the last couple of years.
That’s the best way [to find new music].
Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I love it… things like Camp A Low Hum always let you just discover so many bands. Phoebe Rings is probably the last New Zealand band — yeah, they’re awesome… trippy, interesting, and also catchy tunes…
What about solo stuff? Are you still doing that on the side?
Yeah, I’m working on a solo album as well as a Phoenix Foundation album. It’s pretty exciting working with some of my real musical heroes on that. I’ll have a lot more to say about that next year, but I’m very, very excited about my solo record if I can just bloody finish it.
